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Jul. 18th, 2009 @ 05:29 pm Education
Current Location: Home
Current Mood: exhausted
Current Music: Einaudi
Most of you know of my general apathy (and occasional hatred towards) movies.

But. I must see this.



In other news, today has been mostly spent randomly passing out. Not so good. But I'm sure I'll be better soon.

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[info]frozen_in_honey
Jul. 18th, 2009 @ 05:00 pm So far.
Current Location: KTR
The last of the French invasion seem to be gone now. I have notified the letting agents that I will not be renewing my lease. That might have been a bit premature, have to wait and see, but need to find my own space. In the meantime...

New flatmate seems to be ok. Moving in a week from now. At that point James' French sub-letter (yes, I'm aware) should be moving out. Come October.. we'll see, depends on what happens but I should be out of here in any case. The vendors of the flat I'm trying to buy phoned yesterday; I suspect they're getting impatient. Wouldn't blame them, this has gone so long and involved. It is absurd that I have nearly a 50% deposit and cannot get a mortgage for £36K for a place where I would spend far less in mortgage/maintenance/rent than I do in this rat-hole but there you go.

Flavbirthdaydinner was good, I remember most of it. We had to abandon the garden at some point and take refuge in the basement at Bin Tang. Then we moved to Quinn's, which again was good, although there were a few faces that I thought I would see but were not there. Mind you, by then everybody seemed to have duplicated faces, I can only hope I didn't do anything embarrassing or offended anybody. I don't get drunk often, so perhaps I'm not au fait with the protocols required:D

Didn't make it to Black Plastic last night, shame. Tonight, either Invocation or, wait, the Slimelight. I might go there, some friends I seldom see these days will be there. But then again..

In the meantime, some guitar practice and finishing the book I'm reading -and some doodling in Logic.
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[info]flavius_m
Jul. 18th, 2009 @ 04:59 pm Happy Birthday, [info]unprefixedabbie!!
Tags:
... hope you have a very good one!
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[info]flavius_m
Jul. 18th, 2009 @ 04:42 pm Review of Owen Davies, Grimoires
A  month ago Treadwell's was the venue for Oxford's launch party of Owen Davies seminal study, Grimoires. It is making a gradual but significant impact -- the press has not all rushed out to get excited about it, but people in the know are indeed taking notice.

One is Mark Williams of Peterhouse, and his review is below. You can read it at the original site of Salt Publishing, Horizon, but take the liberty of reprinting it here along with the link. http://www.saltpublishing.com/horizon/issues/02/text/williams_mark.htm. The observant will notice that Treadwell's gets a mention.

Best to everyone, and hope this inspires you to read the book, which really I do think is one of the most important books on magic of our generation, in any country.
Christina

Review of Owen Davies, Grimoires: A History of Magic Books

Grimoires: A History of Magic Books

In his fascinating and frustrating fantasy novel Little, Big (much praised by Harold Bloom), John Crowley gives us an inventor who creates the ‘Patent Cosmo-Opticon, or Theatrum Mundi’, a complex, room-sized mechanical model of the pre-Copernican solar-system and zodiac, perfectly in sync with the motions of the macrocosm. The ‘female mage’ Ariel Hawkquill is able to sit contentedly in her green leather armchair at the centre of the Cosmo-Opticon’s interlocking gyres, enjoying this exact miniature of the occultist’s universe at the present moment: ‘Blue Venus trine with blood-orange Jupiter, each blown-glass figured sphere borne between the tropics on its own band; the mirror-surfaced moon just declining below the horizon, Saturn, milky-grey, just rising.’ Hawksquill uses the Cosmo-Opticon as a abstract tool for magic-as-mental journeying; but another, more pragmatic, spirit in the story finds that if the device is kept perfectly aligned, exactly in tune with outer reality, then macrocosm will duly align with microcosm and the Theatrum Mundi will begin to revolve of its own accord, generating rather than using up power. Thus it has the satisfying side-effect of allowing you to run the household electric off the universe, instead of having to feed the meter with small change. Magic is all about power: specifically, about making the latent machinery of creation, natural and divine, work to one’s own advantage.

By virtue of her femaleness, Crowley’s mage is unusual in her fondness for such lofty, cosmological abstractions. The history of the grimoire — ‘books of conjurations and charms, providing instructions on how to make magical objects’, amongst other things — is very largely a male history. The grimoire reflects a stereotypically masculine love for order and systematisation: like the instruction manual for a new piece of electronic gadgetry, or a piece of Windows software documentation, the grimoire of the imagination promises power but is always most obscure when clarity is most needed, and is just as liable to be linguistically baffling, whether the language of the original document is Korean or purports to be the angelic tongue Enochian.

In his excellent, stylishly-executed Grimoires: A History of Magic Books, Davies is concerned however to dispel some of the misconceptions about the exclusivity of such arcana. In particular, he demonstrates the immense democratisation of occult knowledge brought by printing, and shows that the manual of hermetic lore in fact flourished during the Enlightenment, at precisely the point when Magic, to recall Sir Keith Thomas, was supposed well and truly to have Declined.

Davies begins with a brisk, well-referenced jaunt through the ancient and medieval history of the hermetic text, and we are introduced to the double Jewish/Egyptian origin — or supposed origin — of much of the western occult tradition, presided over by the trio of Moses, Solomon and the legendary sage Hermes Trismegistus, Hermes ‘Thrice-Greatest’.  Magic in antiquity has been something of a scholarly growth area in recent years, and this complex scholarly terrain is negotiated by Davies with relaxed assurance. (Christina Oakley Harrington of Treadwells Bookshop in Covent Garden — itself a treasure house of modern-day grimoires -  has remarked acutely that these days ‘Magic’ is the hot topic academic researchers tend to arrive at once studies of ‘Gender’ and ‘The Body’, etc., have grown stale.) With the coming of Christianity, magic endured a early medieval decline into the doldrums, one of several in its history, and both that dwindling and the immense, sudden impetus given to its study by the 11th century recovery of Greek and Arabic learning is well-handled. Familiarity with the learning of antiquity transmitted via Muslim Spain could and did bestow a reputation for sorcery in the Middle Ages: Gerbert of Aurillac (later Pope Silvester II from 999-1003) was so learned in Arabic astrology that he became regarded after his death as a kind of medieval proto-Faust, his reputation permanently tainted with a faint whiff of sulphur.

Davies’ second chapter, ‘War against Magic’, traces the development and dissemination of the magical book during the early modern period, explaining cogently how natural magicians of stature — Agrippa, Trithemius, Paracelsus — could emerge and write when much of Europe was on the verge of being convulsed by the Witch-Craze. Again, Davies’s handling is fluent and convincing, showing how the grimoire made it into the age of print with the publication of Agrippa’s Fourth Book of Occult Philosophy in Marburg in 1559.

Strong though these chapters are, it is the remaining four sections of the book, dealing broadly with the fate of the magical book in the US and in the modern age, which are most original, and very rich they are. In particular, the attention Davies devotes to African-American and Hispanic experiences of magical texts is likely to be new to most readers. The American magical book began as a WASP phenomenon; Davies  examines the flow of almanacs and magical pamphlets into the New World, pointing out that the grimoire has always flourished where religious and political power is for whatever reason most thinly-spread, and that ‘magic was a central aspect of most people’s conception of Christianity in colonial America.’

There are a number of clever set-pieces: in one section, he mischievously traces the efforts of Mormon historians — I must admit that in my ignorance I hadn’t realised there were such things as Mormon historians — to trace Joseph Smith’s knowledge of printed occult texts and their effect on Book of Mormon and the genesis of the religion associated therewith. The former, with its quasi-Gnostic pseudo-histories, oddly-named angels, appearing-disappearing gold tablets and so on, has much in common with certain types of popular magical texts, especially in that its integrity is licensed by appeal to a charismatic male figure, albeit in this case a prophet rather than a magician. (Though there is some documentary evidence that Smith and his immediate family had a reputation for occult experience, in particular for the use of ‘peep-stones’, talismans and magic circles.) Davies does not make these parallels explicit, preferring, wisely, to let such pleasing ironies emerge from the texture of his swiftly-moving narrative.

Davies is particularly good, in fact, on the historical surprises engendered by the flow and counterflow of texts. Having once had a fascinating and rather alarming reading with an African-American priest of Santería, one of several blends of west African and Catholic beliefs widespread in the US and the Caribbean, I was aware that Yoruba and Fon magical traditions had crossed the Atlantic and flourish to this day in many American cities. But I was surprised to read that the flow has also occurred in the other direction, and that western occult literature and charms have been common in Nigeria from the 1920s. Particular reverence is apparently paid to the tatty texts of an Ohio crossing-sweeper, conman and opportunistic occult plagiarist, William Delaurence (b. 1868), who appears to have been the 19th century equivalent of the Merlins and Morganas who hawk their readings and infallible love-charms in the back of Prediction magazine. Delaurence has also come, bizarrely, to be regarded as a fearsome mythical spirit in some Caribbean communities, ‘being associated with the supernatural figure of a diabolic white-suited man on a white horse that betokened death.’ Still more oddly, as Davies tells us, in Grenada ‘one man, evidently conflating Delaurence with Father Christmas, described him as a magician ‘in Chicago near the North pole [who] lives with a number of pigmy servants.’ Such are the surprising results of cross-cultural esoteric encounters.

A particularly telling juxtaposition in Davies’ narrative occurs in his chapter on 20th century grimoires, ‘Lovecraft, Satan, and Shadows’. He tells us of a 1936 short story, ‘The Grimoire’, by the self-styled ‘Reverend’ Montague Summers (1880-1946), setting it side-by-side with the Wiccan ‘Book of Shadows’. Summers was a strange, over-the-top figure who posed as a Catholic priest, and who was, it seems, quite convinced of the literal truth of the most absurd excesses of medieval and early-modern demonology — amongst other even less healthy obsessions. In Summers’ ‘The Grimoire’, a ‘mysterious book of the witches’ comes to light which brings about a terrifying demonic manifestation; and by some twenty years after the writing of the story, a retired civil servant named Gerald Gardner had, it seems, created a neo-pagan witch-cult in the New Forest, the rites of which were written down in a bricolage of Aleister Crowley and outright invention which purported to be just such a ‘mysterious book’. Gardner termed this text the ‘Book of Shadows’, or, more grandly and with cod-archaic spelling, ‘Ye Bok of ye Art Magical’. Gardner was not, in all likelihood, copying Summers; Gardner’s rather Edwardian, nature-worshipping witch-cult bears no resemblance to Summers’ lurid fantasies of diabolism. Both however were drawing on ideas that were current at the time, in particular the theories of the Egyptologist Margaret Murray (1863-1963), who thought that the ‘witches’ executed in early modern Europe had been practitioners of a surviving pre-Christian fertility religion. Nevertheless, one is grateful that Summers did not live to see the foundation of modern Pagan Witchcraft, which would probably have finished the old boy off.

Other instances occur of life imitating art in the history of the magical text. Perhaps the most famous grimoire of all is fictional: H. P. Lovecraft’s creation, the Necronomicon of the mad Arab Abdul Alhazred, bound in human skin and so unspeakably evil that even to open it is to risk madness and perdition. Lovecraft cunningly wove real people and history into the backstory of his invented grimoire, and, of course, the inevitable has duly come to pass. As Davies writes:

Over the decades several authors have claimed to have discovered manuscript versions, and in the 1980s one magician even claimed to have in his possession a 4,000-year-old grimoire from which the Necronomicon derived. People now practise ‘Lovecraftian’ magic. The most successful of the print editions was the Simon Necronomicon, a ninth-century Greek text discovered by monks and brought to America in the 1970s by an Eastern Orthodox bishop called Simon. The first ‘translated’ edition appeared in a limited leather-bound edition of 666 copies. Subsequent hardback and paperback reprints went on to sell in their many thousands.

Though the Simon Necronomicon is ‘a well-constructed hoax’, ‘like other grimoires … it is their falsity that makes them genuine.’ This, I think, is a key insight: grimoires may not allow one to call demons into outward manifestation — but they can certainly cause other magical books to come into existence. The magical book emerges from Davies’ learned study as intrinsically a composite, palimpsestic and paradoxical genre, simultaneously appealing to and obscuring the tradition which brought it forth.

Davies’ style throughout is clear and readable without scrimping on subtlety, and in all, Grimoires is a fine study which will be found useful by scholars of magical history, European occultism and religious studies, as well as being of interest to the general reader.

O. Davies, Grimoires: A History of Magic Books (Oxford University Press, 2009).

The Reviewer: Mark Williams

Mark Williams is a Research Fellow in Celtic Studies at Peterhouse, Cambridge. He studied Welsh and Irish as a graduate student at Oxford, with a doctorate on astrology and celestial portents in medieval Celtic literature. Before that he studied Classics and English. He is currently working on a cultural history of the gods of Irish mythology, and lectures at Cambridge on Irish and Welsh literature.

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[info]treadwells
Jul. 18th, 2009 @ 04:10 pm Young Newish Pagans in London
Just want to give this young people's gathering a little mention, aimed at those 25 and under. The organisers are known to be sound, thoughtful and welcoming.

Pagan Threads


A monthly coffeeshopmoot for young people: Newcomers, Seekers, Solitaries, and Young People. Exploring the Wheel of the Year, and ideas on Divinity, Worship, Magic and Ritual, in peer led discussion.

Pagan threads is a moot primarily geared towards opening up Paganism for young people who have only had access to solitary work and finding their own information from books and such before, and are looking for an opportunity to communicate their ideas with others. All paths are welcome but discussion is mostly in the immediate cultural context of western traditions such as Wicca.

Not to sound too twee about our name, but the idea is we're hoping to interweave people's many 'threads' of interests into a big informative patchwork of ideas! We know it can be hard for young people to get involved in the Pagan community, with traditional meetings and moots often being held late and in pubs, and directed towards established Pagans rather than people just starting out. For a lot of people, coming to London as a student perhaps or just getting more freedom to explore the London scene is an ideal time to start finding out more about Paganism.

Each moot will have a topic to be thinking about (such as the relevence of the nearest Sabbat), but general discussion is also the idea!

2nd Thursday Monthly ~ £1 ~ Central London

Please contact paganthreads@hotmail.co.uk for more information.
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[info]treadwells
Jul. 18th, 2009 @ 07:57 am Writer's Block: Not So Genius

Which modern invention do you think the world would be better off without?


View other answers



Well, depending on how one defines "modern"
- capitalism
- the automobile
- the drum machine
- the vocoder
- commercial television
- spandex
- fast food
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[info]upasaka
Jul. 18th, 2009 @ 12:52 pm Warrior Soul acoustic gig
Half way through Friday afternoon Jodie rang me about going to see Warrior Soul play acoustically at the Intrepid Fox in the evening. Sounded good to me and meant I got a bit more time with her. Only trouble is I needed to work a bit later and needed to bathe and eat first meaning I couldn't get there till 9.

I left about 5:40 from work and was home and ate. I hopped in the bath then took a while getting ready. I phoned Jodie and found she was still in the Crobar but thinking of going to the Intrepid Fox soon.

We ended up meeting at the end of Denmark Street and we walked along the road chatting while she admired the instruments. We got to the Fox and sat drinking and chatting for a while. This enormous bloke - easily twice the width of my waist than me was sitting nearby with enormous bum cleavage pointing at Jodie that she thought she'd share with me.

We went upstairs when it was open and it was only a fiver. They had some silly stamp in red ink that really didn't show up on Jodie's or my skin. Jodie chatted with some new found friends while I stood nearby and ended up chatting to the trendy bloke up there. Warrior Soul were meant to be on stage at midnight but didn't come on till 12:30 or so. I had no idea what to expect and they weren't bad though by his own admission his voice was a bit fucked. Some bloke next to Jodie was trying to pull her and generally maul her a bit and she was really not interested in him which was a little bemusing. At one point Jodie was trying to persuade me to go to the bar for her so she wouldn't loose her good spot at the front when the lead singer said if you are going to talk go, then took it personally at me striding back through the crowd. I was soon back with drink and managed to get a good spot by Jodie and both of us away from the bloke.

At the end Jodie wanted me to take a photo of her with the lead singer but he buzzed off too quickly. We went downstairs and Jodie's new found friends were talking to the bloke who tried to pull Jodie and he had more attempts before she said we were going. I was bemused to note they all lived in a similar area so would have been sensible to have travelled together, but I think she just wanted to get away.

We chatted while waiting for a bus and I caught a bus with her to Trafalgar Square from where I caught a N41 home. It had been a good night.
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[info]erming
Jul. 18th, 2009 @ 12:42 pm Comicon ...
Is anyone going to Comiccon this year ?
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[info]gaspodex
Jul. 18th, 2009 @ 12:34 pm Birthday Massacre and Adoration
On Thursday after work I rushed to Camden and met up with Dawn, James, Gordon, Jodi and Jodie. We had a swift drink then we went to Wagamamas picking up Graham along the way.

Food was a little while arriving but was quite nice - I like a nice katsu curry. We then headed to Dingwalls, loosing Jodie as she was off to see her friends in the Dev before going to see Warrior Soul.

We got to Dingwalls and there was a monster queue, but once it moved it moved quickly helped by Frankie telling ticket holders to go straight in. Went in and saw Matt North and Lee-anne who was tipsy and nervous. Saw various other people then went down the front with Iain. A while later Adoration came on stage, and while they were good all but Lee-anne were pretty damned static (though once I spotted Rob had moved back a step). Lee-anne moved around a bit but her efforts at swapping places with people and playing bass with them were mostly thwarted. They played a pretty damned good cover of Swamp thing by the Chameleons which was a great song I'd not heard in a while.

During the break I talked to a lot of people and Lorena commented on wearing a coat in the heat. Well it is a light summer raincoat, and I didn't trust the weather. The next band were quite dire so I sought sanctuary at the back and chatted to people and hoped the awful noise would stop.

There was then a break and it was obvious I wasn't going to get that good a spot for the Birthday Massacre so watched the top of Chibi's head (she is very short) and the top bits of some of the band. I needed the toilet then pondered another drink. At the bar Georgie found me and we chatted for a while and she shared her cider with me as someone had gotten her a pint when she wanted a half. Sound wise the band sounded great and I had a good time.

The end came and it was torrentially raining and I was very glad of my coat something very few people there seemed to have. Even with the hood up and zipped up I got quite a bit of water inside it, but huge amounts flooded down my legs meaning despite not stepping in puddles or torrents of water I got soaking wet socks. Grabbed a takeaway on the way to the station and it was still raining heavily when I got home.

It had been a good gig but would have been nicer spending longer talking to Squirry.
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[info]erming
Jul. 18th, 2009 @ 12:03 pm Busy week
Tags:
On Wednesday I went to Florian's for a German lesson.

This time Florian wanted to do a reading comprehension exercise, where he'd read to me some poetry and I had to type what I heard.

So I was listening to Goethe and trying to write what I heard, which was doubly hard as I'd not used a Mac to type German before.

So how did I do?

Well I did quite well on the vowels including often getting umlauts correct. However I wrote down Yah instead of Ja and tsu instead of zu. But overall Florian was quite happy.

So why do the exercise? Well the idea being that if I hear Germans talking I can then go and look it up.
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[info]erming
Jul. 18th, 2009 @ 11:33 am A Sudden Strange Desire for Torrential Rain at Broadstairs
Current Location: Old Kent Road
Current Mood: disappointed
Current Music: Arena - Immortal?
Looking at the Broadstairs programme, just spotted this

Torchlight Procession @ High Street

22:00 to 00:00

A hi-energy flaming spectacle of whirling dancers and music processing through the town

tbc

Weather Permitting of course!


Ceilidh @ Pavilion

23:00 to 01:00

Glorystrokes with caller Gordon Potts

Tickets £10

From barn dance to mosh pit...


Oh no! :-(

Although I don't actually know our dance programme for the weekend, presumably the procession involves all the sides there.

While a torchlight procession with the Hunt would be monumentally cool, it still can't compete with the Glorystrokes, so lots of rain on the 8th please.

Wonder if I can persuade the Hunt to do Thor's Hammer repeatedly until he gets the message (I may not actually believe in Norse gods, but it certainly seems to have the desired effect).
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[info]hmmm_tea
Jul. 18th, 2009 @ 10:54 am So, today
Current Mood: hopeful
Current Music: Underground - David Bowie (Labyrinth OST)
Does anyone want to Do Stuff today?

There's the new Harry Potter film on at the cinema, and also 'Public Enemies' starring both Johnny Depp and Christian Bale, if anyone is interested in either of those.

Alternatively, we can find a pub with a beer garden and chill out, or just hang out at my place and watch films and stuff. I'd suggest a BBQ, but I don't have a garden, and the Weather Forecast isn't promising.

Any takers for any of the above?
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[info]blazingskies
Jul. 18th, 2009 @ 09:18 am Critical Mass
( You are about to view content that may not be appropriate for minors. )
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[info]sallypointzero
Jul. 18th, 2009 @ 07:41 am (no subject)
( You are about to view content that may not be appropriate for minors. )
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[info]miapatrick
Jul. 18th, 2009 @ 01:05 am Leathercare- tricks and tips
The Gent's acquired himself a Sam Browne belt in furtherance of a more-diesel-than-steam-punk effect. Unfortunately, the thing is tough as all hells.
Tricks for softening up tough leather like this so that the belt can actually be buckled properly instead of refusing to bend enough to do so?
We're getting saddle soap and either neatsfoot or mink oil at an equestrian centre this weekend, but tips are still welcome.

The Latin was also for the more-diesel-than-steam-punk, and contributions were very welcome indeed.
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[info]delkaetre_ni
Jul. 17th, 2009 @ 09:03 pm bloody microsoft
( You are about to view content that may not be appropriate for minors. )
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[info]miapatrick
Jul. 17th, 2009 @ 08:23 pm Nigel Kneale would be proud ...
Just a musing - but the more I think about it, the more I realise that I wouldn't have been suprised if the kids had started chanting 'Hufety Pufety Ringstone Round' during TW:COE ...
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[info]gaspodex
Jul. 17th, 2009 @ 07:17 pm 5 Things
Current Location: Old Kent Road
Current Mood: tired
Current Music: Random - Toadstone
This is one of those memes that seems to have gone around a lot for years now and I've so far avoid it. Well until I somehow managed to ask [info]ladyofastolat to pick 5 things from my interests for me to talk about.

Oh well, here goes:

Blue string pudding (English seems inappropriate for this one) whistle whistle-whistle whiiiiistle whistle-whistle-whistle whistle. Whistle whistle whistle whistle-whistle whiiistle whiiiiistle whistle-whistle whistle. Whistle-whistle whistle whistle-whistle-whistle-whistle whistle whistle. Whistle whistle whistle. Whistle-whistle whiiiiistle whistle whiiistle whistle-whistle-whistle whiiiistle. (hope you got that, because that's all the explanation your going to get)

Coathangers This is about the only explanation I can give for this one (it's not my coathanger or my wall, but it is my, rather poorly taken, photograph)


Neil Gaiman I discovered Neil Gaiman when Neverwhere came on TV when I was at school. I bought the book of it shortly after when it came out and have worked my way through most of his other books since. I like the way he manages to ground the fantastic into real life situations, particularly in Neverwhere and American Gods. Rather than creating a whole new reality to talk about, he generally seems to just twist the one we've got to his own ends. Not really looked at the comics much though, as I never really was a big one for comics in general.

Real Ale You can't go around with morris dancers and other real ale drinkers without developing a taste for the stuff, especially when a lot of the other stuff pubs serve drink-wise is fairly tasteless and uninteresting. I therefore fell down that slippery slope. I wouldn't say I've got any particular favourites though, I'll generally go for the ones I know less well, because they might be more of a surprise.

The Goons Here I was, freshly run over with my bagpipes irreparably flattened, and without a remedy. The weight of the steamroller had made a lasting impression on me. I was now two inches thick and twenty-four feet wide. This- this was very awkward. People kept opening and shutting me. Then I discovered the goons had had a very similar storyline and radio 7 was repeating them on a Monday morning. Started listening to them on listen again as I didn't have digital when I first discovered this until I moved back to London and was able to listen to them before going to work (falling in the water is a very good way to wake up on a Monday morning). The rotten swines have deaded them now though :-(
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[info]hmmm_tea
Jul. 17th, 2009 @ 05:06 pm The Bizarreness of Banks
Current Location: Old Kent Road
Current Mood: contemplative
Current Music: Gary Numan - Pure
I've been thinking a lot recently about banks and the way they interact with society, and the more I think about them the more bizarre the concept seems.

So, on the surface, they hold on to the excess money of the rich and lend it to the poor, which sounds a good thing, as it's taking a resource from those that have more then they need and sharing it with those that are short.

However, given these are large companies, their main focus is profit. They need the money from the rich to invest to do this, so they need to encourage the rich to leave it with them and hence pay them a small fee for this and likewise charge a fee for loaning to the poor.

The result being that although there is a temporary flow of money from rich to poor through the bank, the longer-term flow of money goes the other way from those that need it to those who don't. In effect, we seem to have built wealth inequality amplifiers and placed them centrally within our society.

OK, things are a bit different with the co-op and building societies, but they're much less influential to society as a result. You just have to look at the number of the later that demutualised to in order to compete to see that.

There's also North Dakota with it's state owned bank (rather than one the state is bailing out). Although there seems to have been some interesting ideas behind it's setup, as far as I can see it doesn't actually do a lot other than focus it's loans and investments on local industry.

All in all, banks seems a bizarre idea really. What could be a useful public services have been forced into being profit hungry monsters in order to survive.
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[info]hmmm_tea
Jul. 17th, 2009 @ 05:56 pm Weekend Yipee

Yippee it's the weekend… [info]vampyresheep  , myself and rob are invading [info]simonsatori  for the weekend (as he needs to remain within the area to do some cat sitting for those jousting in a muddy field).

The plan is some punting and visits…so we need the sun now!!!

 

Pimms and big sun hat is required when punting….so come on sunshine ..make an appearance

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[info]morbidfrog